Fast links: Interglossa » Glosa »

Re: [glosalist] Re: heretic grammar

Cameron Nedland ("Cameron Nedland" <kansaspatriot@...>) on August 12, 2006

Maybe this is a bad idea, but could we maybe ‘Esperantize’ Glosa a bit by having nouns end in o, verbs in i, etc?

From: Vasiliy <vabot@…> Reply-To: To: Subject: Re: [glosalist] Re: heretic grammar Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 12:57:16 +0400

I had wrote about this problem in february 2006 (theme of my letter: “Kani vora vora”).

Glosa must be improved, cause this language have vagueness of syntax rules.

Let’s compare Glosa with English:

The cow eats

There is not a verb marker but in English (!!) we use the suffix ~s~ in the verb. English have many irregular suffixes and implicit markers. Such irregular constructions help to orient in the syntax structure.

If a conlang is ‘completely syntax oriented’ and have not implicit and irragular additional resources, it should NOT COPY English.

In february’s letter i wrote about:

Subject marker ‘u’ (s~U~bect) Verb marker ‘je’ (j + v~E~rb) Object marker ‘o’ (~O~bject)

Also, it’s possible to use ‘ve’ (VE~rb) as a verb marker, but it is in use as short ‘vesti’. Therefor ‘ve’ as ‘vesti’ must be changed (for example) to ‘ves’ or somehow else.

Kevin Smith use ‘ca’ and ‘da’. I think that ‘da’ sounds better then ‘o’. I don’t know what is better: ‘ca’ or ‘je’ or ‘ve’.

Kevin, I’d like your ideas!

~~ A few my thoughts about noun, subject and object markers ~~

Articles (‘a’ and ‘the’) are used in English as implicit subject and object markers. For example, article ‘the’ is used as implicit object marker in phrase “Fill the same”, and as implicit subject marker in phrase “The cow eats”

Indeed, a completely syntax oriented language is NOT in NEED of NOUN marker or any articles. BUT, it is in GREAT need of subject and object markers.

Therefor, IMHO, the marker ‘U’ may be move away at all, as well as any others articles.

In february i wrote of using ‘u’ as a subject marker, but it might confused somebody, who earlier had using it as a noun marker (article) in Glosa.

May be ‘su’ (~SU~bject) would be better?

For example:

Su plu bovi je (/ca) vora da grasti S’mi ca vora da frukti (But the marker ‘su’ may be omitted in order SVO)

Using of subject and object markers gives us an oppotunity to use the FREE order of words.


Su plu bovi je (/ca) vora da grasti (SVO) Ca vora da grasti su plu bovi (VOS) Da grasti ca vora s’plu bovi (OVS) Da grasti su plu bovi ca vora (OSV) S’plu bovi da grasti ca vora (SOV) and so on

And else:

IMHO, any preposition is an object marker by its realy function, therefor using of construction ~preposition + marker U~ has redundancy.

I think such consruction must be move away: Un andra es ge-morda ex u kani. -> Andra es ge-morda ex kani. An pa dice gratia a mi de u bibli. -> An pa dice da gratia a mi de bibli.


Examples (modification of ‘18 step’ examples):

Mi fu lekto u bibli. -> (S’) Mi fu lekto da bibli. Mi pa lekto plu bibli. -> Mi pa lekto da plu bibli. Mi pa visita u teatra. -> Mi pa visita da teatra.

An pa dice gratia a mi de u bibli. -> (Su) An pa dice (da) gratia a mi de bibli. Un andra es ge-morda ex u kani. -> (Su) Andra es ge-morda ex kani.

Mi fu dice Glosa -> Mi fu dice da Glosa

A gono es u posta-teka. -> A gono es su posta-teka. = Su posta-teka es a gono. (!)

{‘A gono es u posta-teka’ is in order OVS in ‘18 step’ text, but WHY it might be correctly, if Ashby-Glosa has no free-order resources?}

A proxi gono es u strata-lampa -> A proxi gono es su strata-lampa (in order OVS) U Teo es mi pastora. -> Teo es da mi pastora. = Da mi pastoro es su Teo. An duce mi para plu paci aqa -> An ca duce da mi para plu paci aqa = S’an ca duce para plu paci akwa da mi

Vasiliy Terehov Sochi, Russia

Excuse me for my bad English.

—–Original Message—– From: “Kevin Smith” <lingua@…> To: Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 01:04:48 -0000 Subject: [glosalist] Re: heretic grammar

Yahoo! Groups Links

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it’s FREE!

Fast links: Interglossa » Glosa »

Re: [glosalist] Re: heretic grammar - Committee on language planning, FIAS. Coordination: Vergara & Hardy, PhDs.